Okay, so the carnivore subreddits are on fire right now. Someone posted a ribeye with butter and shredded cheese, and the comments turned into a full-on philosophical debate about what "real carnivore" even means. People are asking, "Is cheese carnivore?" and "Am I doing it wrong if I use seasonings?"
Here's the vibe: The community is splitting into two camps—purists who say beef and water only, and pragmatists who include dairy, eggs, and seasonings. And honestly? This debate reveals way more about the carnivore movement's identity crisis than about nutrition.
The Two Camps
The Purists: Lion Diet or Nothing
The purist camp follows what's called the Lion Diet: ruminant meat (beef, lamb, bison), salt, and water. That's it. No dairy, no eggs, no bacon, no coffee, no seasonings beyond salt.
Their argument:
- Dairy causes inflammation and digestive issues for many people
- Eggs are allergenic for some
- Pork is harder to source cleanly (factory farming, feed quality)
- Seasonings can trigger cravings and mask food sensitivities
- The simpler the diet, the easier to identify what works and what doesn't
On Reddit, the purists are the ones saying, "If you're eating cheese, you're not carnivore, you're keto." They argue that the whole point of carnivore is elimination—stripping out everything except the most bioavailable, least reactive foods. Adding dairy or eggs defeats the purpose.
The purist mindset: Carnivore is a therapeutic elimination diet, not a flexible lifestyle. If you're not healing or optimizing, you're not doing it right. Strict adherence is the point.
The Pragmatists: Animal-Based Is Carnivore
The pragmatist camp includes dairy, eggs, bacon, butter, and sometimes even honey or fruit (which gets controversial). They call themselves "carnivore" or "animal-based" interchangeably.
Their argument:
- Dairy and eggs are nutrient-dense and historically consumed by humans
- Cheese makes the diet more sustainable long-term
- Seasonings improve enjoyment without causing harm for most people
- Rigid rules create unnecessary restriction and make it harder to stick with
- "Carnivore" means prioritizing animal foods, not dogmatic exclusion
On Reddit, the pragmatists are the ones posting cheese-heavy meals and saying, "If it comes from an animal, it's carnivore." They argue that the diet should be sustainable and enjoyable, not a purity test. If dairy or eggs don't cause issues for you, why eliminate them?
The pragmatist mindset: Carnivore is a framework for prioritizing animal foods, not a religion. Flexibility and adherence matter more than perfection. Results speak louder than rules.
Where the Fight Gets Real
This resonates because the purist vs pragmatist split isn't just about food—it's about what the carnivore movement represents.
The Purity Spiral
The purists are worried about what they call the "purity spiral"—the idea that if you allow dairy today, tomorrow someone's adding fruit, and next week someone's calling themselves carnivore while eating a mostly-keto diet. They see this as diluting the message and confusing newcomers.
On r/carnivore, you'll see comments like:
- "This sub is turning into r/keto with meat pics."
- "You can't claim carnivore results if you're eating cheese every meal."
- "Dairy is not carnivore. Full stop."
The purists see themselves as protecting the integrity of the diet. They argue that loose definitions prevent people from experiencing true carnivore benefits because they're still consuming potential irritants.
The Sustainability Problem
The pragmatists counter that dogmatic restriction leads to burnout and quitting. They point to the high dropout rate among strict carnivores and argue that allowing some flexibility (dairy, eggs, seasoning) helps people stick with the diet long-term.
On r/zerocarb, you'll see comments like:
- "I tried lion diet for 60 days and quit because it was miserable. Adding cheese back made it sustainable."
- "Not everyone needs therapeutic elimination. Some of us just want to feel good."
- "Results matter more than rules. If dairy works for you, eat dairy."
The pragmatists see themselves as making carnivore accessible. They argue that real-world adherence beats theoretical purity, and that most people get 90% of the benefits without going full lion diet.
What the Science Actually Says
Here's where it gets interesting: Both camps are kind of right, depending on your goals and biology.
When Purists Are Right
If you're dealing with autoimmune issues, severe gut dysfunction, or unresolved health problems, the lion diet approach makes sense. Dairy, eggs, and seasonings can be inflammatory for some people, and elimination is the only way to know.
The purist approach is also better for short-term therapeutic intervention. If you're trying to identify food sensitivities or heal gut lining, stripping everything down to beef/salt/water for 30-90 days gives you a clean baseline.
Research on elimination diets supports this: The fewer variables, the easier it is to identify triggers. If you're eating 10 different foods, it's hard to know which one is causing inflammation. If you're eating one food, diagnosis is simple.
When Pragmatists Are Right
If you're metabolically healthy, not dealing with autoimmune issues, and just trying to optimize energy and body composition, adding dairy and eggs doesn't seem to hurt most people. The pragmatist approach is more sustainable long-term and fits better into social situations.
Historical and anthropological evidence supports this too: Most meat-based cultures consumed dairy (if they had access) and eggs. The Maasai drink milk and blood. The Mongols made cheese. Strict beef-only eating is a modern therapeutic invention, not an ancestral norm.
The pragmatist approach also aligns better with athletic performance and muscle building, where higher protein variety and calorie density can be beneficial.
The Real Question: What Are You Optimizing For?
This is where the community needs to get clearer: The "right" version of carnivore depends entirely on your goals.
You should go purist (lion diet) if:
- You have autoimmune conditions or chronic inflammation
- You suspect food sensitivities but don't know which ones
- You're doing a short-term elimination experiment (30-90 days)
- You've tried pragmatic carnivore and still have symptoms
You should go pragmatist (animal-based) if:
- You're metabolically healthy and just optimizing
- You've tested dairy/eggs and tolerate them fine
- You need variety to stick with the diet long-term
- You're focused on performance, muscle building, or body composition
The community is saying this needs to be said louder: Both approaches are valid for different contexts. The problem is when people treat their version as the only version.
The Identity Crisis
Here's what this debate really reveals: The carnivore community is going through a growth phase, and with growth comes identity questions.
Early carnivore (2015-2020) was a small, tight-knit group of people with serious health issues doing therapeutic elimination. Everyone was on the same page because everyone had the same goal: healing.
Now (2025-2026), carnivore is mainstream. You have biohackers optimizing performance, bodybuilders building muscle, regular people losing weight, and therapeutic eliminators healing autoimmune conditions—all calling themselves "carnivore."
The purists want to preserve the original therapeutic focus. The pragmatists want to make it accessible to more people. Both are reacting to the same thing: the movement is changing, and nobody's sure what it should become.
The Reddit Drama (Real Examples)
To show you how heated this gets, here are real comment threads from the last two weeks:
Thread 1: "Is butter carnivore?"
- Purist response: "Butter is dairy. Dairy is not carnivore. Use tallow or nothing."
- Pragmatist response: "Butter is 99% fat from an animal. Of course it's carnivore."
- Result: 150+ comment argument about what "from an animal" means
Thread 2: "Progress pic with eggs and bacon"
- Purist response: "Great results, but this is keto, not carnivore."
- Pragmatist response: "Eggs and bacon are literally animal products. Stop gatekeeping."
- Result: Mods had to lock the thread
Thread 3: "Should r/carnivore allow dairy posts?"
- Purist vote: Create r/animalbased for dairy-inclusive people
- Pragmatist vote: Dairy is carnivore, no split needed
- Result: Still arguing, no resolution
This is resonating because it's not just Reddit drama—it's people genuinely confused about what they're supposed to be doing. And the louder the two camps yell at each other, the more newcomers feel paralyzed.
What Actually Matters
Here's the practical takeaway: Stop worrying about what camp you're in and focus on your actual results.
Ask yourself:
- Are you seeing improvements in energy, body composition, inflammation, and mental clarity?
- Is your current approach sustainable for you long-term?
- Have you tested whether dairy/eggs affect you negatively?
- Are you optimizing for healing or for performance?
If you're getting results and you feel good, you're doing it right. If you're stuck or symptomatic, try the stricter elimination approach for 30-60 days and see what changes.
The community is saying the real mistake is letting internet arguments dictate your food choices. The loudest voices on Reddit aren't necessarily the most informed—they're just the most opinionated.
The Bottom Line
The carnivore community is splitting into purists (beef/salt/water) and pragmatists (animal-based with dairy/eggs). Both camps have valid points depending on context. Purists are right for therapeutic elimination and autoimmune healing. Pragmatists are right for long-term sustainability and performance optimization.
The debate isn't really about food—it's about identity. As carnivore grows from a therapeutic niche to a mainstream movement, people are fighting over what it should represent. The purists want to protect the original healing focus. The pragmatists want to make it accessible to more people.
The actual answer? Do what works for your biology and goals. Test, measure, adjust. Don't let Reddit arguments override your personal experience. And if you're new and confused, start strict for 30 days (lion diet), then add back one thing at a time and see how you respond.
The community will keep arguing. You don't have to pick a side—just pick what works for you.